Interesting, do you mean Yudkowsky specifically or "rationalists" more generally? I remember reading that Yudkowsky was especially influenced by a sci fi writer named A. E. van Vogt, who was himself influenced by an author named Alfred Korzybski, an independent scholar who had his own scheme for dramatically upgrading the way we think (Nevala-Lee has a post about him at https://nevalalee.wordpress.com/2016/10/11/to-be-or-not-to-be-2/ and Andrew Pilsch's 'Self-Help Supermen' article I linked above talks about Korzybski and van Vogt starting on p. 526, with more on the connection on p. 531-535, and p. 527-528 also reference an earlier article relevant to van Vogt and the dream of 'upgrading' oneself, 'Super Men' by Brian Attebery at https://www.jstor.org/stable/4240674).
By "these guys" I meant the Zizians specifically, but I learned it as a fact about a broader, disunified post-Vassar branch of the LessWrong/Extropian movement that included them, Jess Taylor, and Ziz's mentor Alice M. (all mentioned and/or linked above in Max's piece). And yes, the Korzybski and Van Vogt influences seem very important for Yudkowsky. Thanks for the link to Nevala-Lee, that's a nice article!
Thanks, did any of that group ever write about Cordwainer Smith or what they got out of his writing, or more like something you heard about through friends-of-friends etc.? Also when you talk about the post-Vassar branch, is that all people who had been working with Vassar either at MIRI/CFAR or at Leverage, with Jessica Taylor talking about cultishness in both at https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/MnFqyPLqbiKL8nSR7/my-experience-at-and-around-miri-and-cfar-inspired-by-zoe and with Scott Alexander blaming it on the "Vassarites" in a comment?
I heard about it directly in person at events and I haven't read enough of their online stuff to know if they wrote about it or not. This wasn't all the people who had worked with Vassar, just "a" post-Vassar branch among at least a couple different ones. Another was more "magick" with strong Crowleyan influences, sort of a The Invisibles LARP. There was some overlap of branches and it would probably be hard to describe exact boundaries between them even for insiders. Leverage wasn't particularly influenced by Vassar so I'd consider them a separate thing.
Interesting, do you mean Yudkowsky specifically or "rationalists" more generally? I remember reading that Yudkowsky was especially influenced by a sci fi writer named A. E. van Vogt, who was himself influenced by an author named Alfred Korzybski, an independent scholar who had his own scheme for dramatically upgrading the way we think (Nevala-Lee has a post about him at https://nevalalee.wordpress.com/2016/10/11/to-be-or-not-to-be-2/ and Andrew Pilsch's 'Self-Help Supermen' article I linked above talks about Korzybski and van Vogt starting on p. 526, with more on the connection on p. 531-535, and p. 527-528 also reference an earlier article relevant to van Vogt and the dream of 'upgrading' oneself, 'Super Men' by Brian Attebery at https://www.jstor.org/stable/4240674).
Searching lesswrong.com for mentions of van Vogt I see Yudkowsky talks about his influence at length in the post at https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/q79vYjHAE9KHcAjSs/rationalist-fiction and there's also a more recent Yudkowsky post at https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/YicoiQurNBxSp7a65/is-clickbait-destroying-our-general-intelligence where he name checks him and a few others, saying "I was pretty much raised and socialized by my parents' collection of science fiction. My parents' collection of old science fiction. Isaac Asimov. H. Beam Piper. A. E. van Vogt. Early Heinlein, because my parents didn't want me reading the later books."
By "these guys" I meant the Zizians specifically, but I learned it as a fact about a broader, disunified post-Vassar branch of the LessWrong/Extropian movement that included them, Jess Taylor, and Ziz's mentor Alice M. (all mentioned and/or linked above in Max's piece). And yes, the Korzybski and Van Vogt influences seem very important for Yudkowsky. Thanks for the link to Nevala-Lee, that's a nice article!
Thanks, did any of that group ever write about Cordwainer Smith or what they got out of his writing, or more like something you heard about through friends-of-friends etc.? Also when you talk about the post-Vassar branch, is that all people who had been working with Vassar either at MIRI/CFAR or at Leverage, with Jessica Taylor talking about cultishness in both at https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/MnFqyPLqbiKL8nSR7/my-experience-at-and-around-miri-and-cfar-inspired-by-zoe and with Scott Alexander blaming it on the "Vassarites" in a comment?
I heard about it directly in person at events and I haven't read enough of their online stuff to know if they wrote about it or not. This wasn't all the people who had worked with Vassar, just "a" post-Vassar branch among at least a couple different ones. Another was more "magick" with strong Crowleyan influences, sort of a The Invisibles LARP. There was some overlap of branches and it would probably be hard to describe exact boundaries between them even for insiders. Leverage wasn't particularly influenced by Vassar so I'd consider them a separate thing.